Warner's question to Petraeus

[Max Shapiro]

Warner- Do you believe this war in Iraq is making America Safer
Petraeus- "I don't know, I haven't sat down and thought about it. What I have been focused on, what I have been riveted on, is accomplishing the mission of multi-national force Iraq

wow. You cant really talk shit about the general as he has no choice but to implement Bush's polices and by most measures the surge is working on the military side so he is doing a good job. Unfortunately there was no political surge so things are never going to get better in the long term. Still its very sad that the commander of our forces in Iraq cannot say whether this war is making us safer, and everyone knows that means he thinks its not, but is too good of a soldier to just throw his commander and chief overboard.

[narwhal]

You can't even look half intelligent talking about skimboarding.... so you think people will not laugh at you talk about politics?

interesting.

[Max Shapiro]

i hope people will make me laugh while talking about me talking about politics, but either way you totally didnt even mention my post. Funny thing is weve had constructive talks about politics on here narwhal, seems your jumping on the hate max bandwagon because he has balls enough to disagree and argue with the majority and not back down. But thats cool, you say some funny shit, id rather have you making fun of me than sucking my dick.

[Max Shapiro]

to quote chris mathews;

"could you believe what would have happend if Eisenhower had said to the troops before D-day, 'Good luck soldiers, i dont know if this is going to make us safer, but good luck just the same"

[narwhal]

I didn't answer Young Peter because it's almost not worth my message board filled time.

I think before the crack debates, i own skimboarding, and other delightful threads you were fun to talk with.

[Max Shapiro]

i never said i owned skimboarding anywhere, your just putting words in my mouth. There was a thread about how i thought the judging system was flawed and how i thought it should be fixed and there is the thread about how much i suck at skimboarding and how the OG's in vb started the east coast scene 20 years ago. No where is there anything about me owning skimboarding.

Back on topic, you dont think a topic about the top commander in iraq saying he doesnt know if the conflict is making america safer is worth your time?

[narwhal]

Points you are missing:

- Don't compare any modern general to a WW2 era general. It's not fair...everything has changed. aka most important part the media.

- Petraeus is a very intelligent guy and most likely has thought about it but is not going to speak his mind

- Petraeus works for the president and this country...you really think every military person believes in the mission?

[Max Shapiro]

points you missed

I know he has thought about it, i said so, and then i said he didnt speak his mind because he wasnt going to betray the president. Did you overlook that or did you not bother reading my post at all because you think im stupid? As for your third point i said the same thing you did in my post pretty much, he works for the president and it is his job to carry out policies not make them.
As for WWII it was simply a matter of what his statement would do to morale. What are our soldiers going to think when there commander says he isnt sure whether they are doing anything to help our country in Iraq. Chris was comparing that to what would have happened if Ike said the same thing before D-Day.

Next time read my post more carefully, unless you like acting like im an idiot while your agreeing with my points.

[narwhal]

Ok when in the military you have no public political thoughts.

From private to general.

Those who speak out are forced to resign and to think Bush is the first to do this is a laughing matter. Korean War and Vietnam war had similar standings and even looking back there have been more.

Also you are an idiot for quoting Chris Mathews; do I honestly have to point out the idiotic shit he has said?

Also another fact you're missing morality and war don't mix. Even your beloved Eisenhower did many unethical things in war.

[vicskim76]

damn max stop posting such long messages. it doesnt prove your point any better.

[Max Shapiro]

I know when your in the military you have no political thoughts, thats why he never spoke his mind. Ike isnt my beloved, i know all about the unethical shit that went down in WWII, it was simply an analogy, a similar one would be what If Schwarzkopf had said he didnt know if we were doing the right thing before we kicked Iraq out of Kuwait, the point is that his statement is not going to be good for morale. I quoted him because it was a good analogy, the point of it was to illustrate how devestating that statement is going to be to our troops morale. What if you were a soldier and all of a sudden you hear your commander doesnt know if were protecting our country or not (regardless of what he thinks on the inside its what he said that matters, had he said it is not my place to make that call this would be a non-story).

Again read more closely.

[narwhal]

Dude i think anyone with a 14 on an IQ test (slightly above you) can see it was a bullshit answer. A troop knows he did not mean it that way, he just did not want to answer it.

It's not "devestating" (wtf) to the morale like i said..."Dude i think anyone with a 65 on an IQ test (slightly above you) can see it was a bullshit answer."

Stop with this read closely bullshit and focus on fixing grammar mistakes in your posts. When you post like that it makes you look more like an idiot than you appear. (is that even possible? (rhetorical))

[ejb]

to quote chris mathews;

"could you believe what would have happend if Eisenhower had said to the troops before D-day, 'Good luck soldiers, i dont know if this is going to make us safer, but good luck just the same"

to be perfectly honest, before the zimmerman note and such the war in europe really had no effect on the homefront at all...we just went in because england was declared war on or declared war, not so sure...now the japs on the other hand yes, so a quote involving japs would have made more sense...sucks to get told by a junior in h.s. doesnt it?

edit: we went to war against the axis in europe due to the immoral things they were doing and to help the ol brits and canadians and damn frenchies these include. , unrestricted warfare...concentration camps, invadind innocent and neutral countries e.t.c.

[Max Shapiro]

your point is irrelevant. WWII was the war against facism, had we not defeated hitler America would have been next. Japan would not have been a better analogy because D-Day was the largest invasion ever mounted.

Narwhal, many people are already thinking that the war in Iraq is not making us safer, congressmen/women, senators, presidential candidates, do you really think that Petreaus saying he doesnt know isnt going to have an effect? Of course it is, soldiers are going to think that Petraues has doubts about the war making america safer, and even though he said he didnt know, you think its obvious that he doesnt think it is. If its that obvious then the soldiers are going to know that, thats going to bring down there morale.

edit- i dont give a shit about grammer, im not writing laws, im writing my thoughts, better grammar is not going to change my point, nor is it going to make your comprehension of my point any better. Then again you said the exact same things i did in my first post in your earlier post, so maybe if the grammar was perfect you would have realized you were agreeing with me.

[hobo]

to be perfectly honest, before the zimmerman note and such the war in europe really had no effect on the homefront at all...we just went in because england was declared war on or declared war, not so sure...now the japs on the other hand yes, so a quote involving japs would have made more sense...sucks to get told by a junior in h.s. doesnt it?

edit: we went to war against the axis in europe due to the immoral things they were doing and to help the ol brits and canadians and damn frenchies these include. , unrestricted warfare...concentration camps, invadind innocent and neutral countries e.t.c.

except for the fact that we went to war with germany/italy because they were allies with japan. it is said that the US didnt know about concentration camps. Talking about camps, how about sending thousands of japs to camps.

[Icej]

Max always has paragraph answers. I rarely read them.

[Max Shapiro]

if thats the case for everyone else no wonder you all think im stupid, you read the 2 line posts of people talking shit that never bothered to read my post in the first place, everything is starting to make sense now. Oh well, exercises in pointless writing 101.

[Icej]

I never comment in your topics though. This would be my first time. I don't know if you are stupid or not, because I don't read your posts. I do know you argue about everything though.

[Max Shapiro]

It takes two people too argue, one person who thinks one thing, one person who thinks another. Arguing is just those people laying out there views and how they came to those views and how the views of the other differ from theirs. I think differently than most people on here so yeah, you all are going to argue with me and im going to argue back. You all forget the arguments start when i say something i believe and everyone starts jumping down my throat because they think differently, whose the least mature one there?

[RavesIsBack]

watch out guys, he is just playing devil's advocate again

and to answer your last question...YOU!

[Icej]

It takes two people too argue, one person who thinks one thing, one person who thinks another. Arguing is just those people laying out there views and how they came to those views and how the views of the other differ from theirs. I think differently than most people on here so yeah, you all are going to argue with me and im going to argue back. You all forget the arguments start when i say something i believe and everyone starts jumping down my throat because they think differently, whose the least mature one there?

Yea, I am not going to read this.

[LAXitives288]

Don't bother, i'm sure you already know how superior he thinks he is.

[cmallen111]

I am with Ice J, anything past two-three lines is hard work to read when its such a meaningless argument.

[ejb]

max is just mad that he runs two mph and doesnt realize why he isn't great at skimming

[LAXitives288]

but thats exactly where youre wrong, max is the best in VB except for 2 sponsored guys, duhh!


and he fracking bitches no one reads what he says and just makes personal attacks.

[Luff]

hXc!

[bhassan]

This vid made it onto CNN

Youtube is gettin outta control

[narwhal]

hahahahahahah love it.

[lil chuck]

You all forget the arguments start when i say something i believe and everyone starts jumping down my throat because they think differently, whose the least mature one there?

you forgot that no one cares what you think and the only thing jumping down you throat is your girlfriends dick.